Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: Foreign.
[00:00:13] Speaker B: Wings, family.
[00:00:14] Speaker A: Hope everyone is doing well. Today we are doing an episode on women in leadership, and we are going to be talking about something many women rarely discuss honestly, the weight of always being the strong one. And for some women, leadership and responsibility do feel empowering. But for others was started as resilience slower fully becomes survival mode. The problem isn't being strong. The problem isn't feeling like you have no choice. Being the person everyone relies on while quietly caring more than anyone realizes. With that being said, we have a special guest here with us today, Ms. Trish. She is a educator and she is a woman in leadership that we are going to be picking her brain and just talking about how she balances it all.
[00:00:55] Speaker C: Welcome, Trish.
[00:00:56] Speaker B: Thank you. Very excited to be here with you ladies today.
[00:00:59] Speaker C: Yes, we're happy to have you. I'm gonna actually jump into one of the lighter questions for you.
What would you tell a woman who's chasing their next level? Like, if you can give two pieces of advice or one piece of advice up to you. What would you tell a woman chasing her next level? Because obviously you went from teacher.
[00:01:18] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:01:19] Speaker C: To a woman in leadership. Right. So there's a big gap there which we all experience in our careers, businesses.
Tell me what you can tell her.
[00:01:28] Speaker B: A woman who is ready for the next thing and if she's sort of has that the fire, which is the passion and part of the vision, knows that this is what I want. Don't question yourself. Go for it.
What happens a lot, and it definitely happened to me along the way of, you know, having a very strong feeling about what is right, what I want to have happen, how I want to be in it. It changes. And it changes as you grow and as you develop. But if that's always there, go with that. I've learned to. Even though I, you know, part of being reflective is questioning yourself, maybe questioning those around you think get to a point where you have to stop questioning the outside so much because what happens once you get to a position?
And I'm currently almost 14 years in this current position.
And I remember being very, you know, I want it and I'm going to do it. And I was turning 41, and then you're in it and you get what you wanted and you're like, whoa. And there's no going back. I'm not the same person today that I was then. Whereas now, you know, if a decision has to be made or a question comes up, you just have to act in the moment.
And all of that is it might be that I've had this conversation previously. So the, the response is natural. Sometimes it's something completely new and different. A new problem comes up and you make a decision, you say something. But I know you also have to be, you know, if something is for the general common good, you don't always get it right in the moment.
And I think being honest about that, I believe in, you know, a leadership style that's very transparent, that is reflective, that know, we'll do this now and we'll see how it went and if needed, go back. So what I say today, you know, is sort of based on the experience and the information at hand, but nothing is truly fixed and in stone.
[00:03:23] Speaker C: And so it's kind of like that quote when they, when they say, leap and the wings will appear.
[00:03:28] Speaker B: Oh, I don't know that quote. Do we know?
[00:03:31] Speaker C: That's one of my favorites, the wings.
[00:03:33] Speaker B: Yes. That is, you're just taking a chance.
[00:03:36] Speaker C: And whether it's right or wrong. Yeah.
[00:03:38] Speaker B: Trust me.
[00:03:38] Speaker C: Whether it's right or wrong, you deal with it as it comes. Right. Because we are imperfect people, so we're all flawed.
[00:03:45] Speaker B: Right. But I think like it goes back to your code and you know, what, how you operate. And it's sort of, for me, it's like, do the right thing. The want is always the best for everyone. So the intention is good.
[00:03:56] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:03:56] Speaker B: So then with that you trust yourself.
The wings will pop out. They have to. Your wings don't pop out, you can hit the ground.
[00:04:03] Speaker A: How do you deal with knowing that you're not going to please everyone?
[00:04:08] Speaker B: Oh yeah, you just write the people pleasing is part of it.
[00:04:13] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:04:13] Speaker B: That I think a lot of women struggle with because we're sort of born to, you know, if you look at how males and females are, just how we are so different, our brains are different. But I think knowing why you do certain things and because even like you have, let's say, a work event, you have to say like, is this the police? Is this really like a people pleasing thing? And you know, realizing that it's. No, I do it because I enjoy it, because I think it's right.
[00:04:40] Speaker C: And just.
[00:04:42] Speaker B: Yeah, sorry, no, finish your thought and went away like a little bird. Like a little bird with wings.
[00:04:48] Speaker C: I was just thinking a woman in leadership has an aerial view. Right.
[00:04:52] Speaker A: Of things.
[00:04:52] Speaker C: And so you're, you're making moves, you're making decisions, you are revamping things and reorganizing things. And sometimes the people that are part of that don't always see it from an aerial view. So that for me, as a woman who owns her own business, that would calm, you know, my people pleasing tendencies. Because you don't always know why I'm changing my prices or throwing out a discount or doing this or making that move. Like as the leader, you don't have to always inform the people and they may not always be pleased. And that's. Nina and I talk about this in our other episodes to calm the focus and connection to the external because then you know, self concept wise, you're always clocking what somebody is thinking of you or how you're being perceived.
So that goes back to what you said about the, the, the outside noise.
[00:05:43] Speaker B: You were. Oh yeah. Oh yeah.
[00:05:45] Speaker A: Worry about how you are perceived or
[00:05:47] Speaker B: what people think about you.
When you ask me that, what I say, I remember, I say I don't care like it is what it is. And I. But then realizing that's not 100% true. That's sort of like part of like the humor, like the faces and the masks that you wear.
[00:06:00] Speaker C: We all do it and humans care. You just manage it.
[00:06:03] Speaker B: Right. You have to again, you have to get to a place where you are looking. It's the bird's eye view, it's the balcony perspective in educational leadership, you know, seeing all like being, it's sort of like a game of chess, even with things like hiring.
So yes, there are times where you invite the feedback because it is a community.
But there are sometimes like I, I am in this position to make a decision.
It's you know, if, when you can't reach consensus or you know, like here's the yes or the no, here it is. And it's not always up to the community feedback because I am responsible and positions of leadership. Every boss has a boss and I don't. And this happened actually recently when somebody said, well, you know, it would really be great. Maybe you meet one on one. And I said that in an ideal scenario, great. I don't have the time right now, so we're past that. Yeah, I'll let you know what the next step's going to look like.
And it's never to put anybody down it. And you, you develop that over time. Like because my personality is strong, you know, just growing up in New York, being an Italian American, being a parentified eldest daughter, you don't want to attend. But sometimes like I don't and I see like I don't want to make you cry, but I wasn't the intent.
Here we are.
Yeah, it happens. And there were times when I beat myself up over that and then. And there's always like that thinking of like, oh, if only I knew back that. Well, you didn't because that's part of the development. It's part of growing up. It's part of sticking with it. Your job, your decisions.
It's a lot.
[00:07:36] Speaker A: Yeah, but you feel you're a natural born leader or do you feel like those skills have developed over time?
[00:07:41] Speaker B: So interesting. That's so interesting because I did this activity know, introducing myself, let's say, to new staff. And I show my, my picture of when I was like three months old.
And I've done this with staff. I've done this at a training session. Like, sort of close your eyes, raise your hands if you have this. Raise your hands if you have rbf. Raise your hands if you have bd.
And then, and then the next slide is like, here's, here's my picture. This is me at three months old. Big DeVito Energy.
And it was sort of. People said, well, you were, you had that position when you were born. And I really wonder how much of it is nature, how much of it is nurture, how much of it is trauma, how much? And you'll never know. You'll. You'll never have that moment where you could say, okay, here is everything explained.
So I think part of it is pecking order. I think it's being the firstborn. I think it's, you know, second generation Italian American. It's what work means, what.
But I will say now I enjoy it. I. This. I. The path I'm on is not the, not the one I expected that it would be. It really isn't.
But it was sort of like being presented with something at the time, jumping on it. And when I tell you for the first couple of years, years, you, you wonder, like, will this position be the end of me because I was so, like, emotionally sensitive. Much more, you know, I wasn't as mature as I am now. It was, it's, it's the same job 14 years ago. 14 years younger. You're not the same person.
No, but I, and I could have done other things, but sticking with it and sort of being through that, but also not knowing what's next. Right. And I think the question was, like, what came first, the chicken or the egg in leadership, I wanted to, I
[00:09:22] Speaker C: wanted to ask you just to piggyback off of the eldest daughter thing. We have a lot in common in terms of our backgrounds. Italian American, big Italian family, eldest daughter.
[00:09:31] Speaker B: Yep.
[00:09:32] Speaker C: Very much in the role of like the caretaker, the helper. The fixer, the doer.
Have you felt that people come to you when they need you?
[00:09:41] Speaker B: Oh, yeah, of course.
[00:09:42] Speaker C: Does that.
Does that roll over into where we're different?
[00:09:47] Speaker B: Is the astrology. We don't have to go to the podcast. Of course people come to me.
[00:09:51] Speaker C: I'm the weird air sign that you are the weird air.
[00:09:54] Speaker B: I'm ready for cancer season in two water signs.
[00:10:00] Speaker C: I love it.
[00:10:00] Speaker B: I love that night. I met somebody and I just kind of knew you kind of. You feel the energy. And I didn't want to ask. And they were talking and I see they were actually talking like this, like I do. And finally I said, when's your birthday? Because I said, well, not. I didn't ask. I said, my birthday is coming up June 28th. And then this was like July 14th. I said, oh my goodness, there we have it. Also on the same. In a similar position in the leadership role. 16 years younger. Who I was just like, you know, there were just like sparkles.
[00:10:31] Speaker C: SM
[00:10:34] Speaker B: good like.
But isn't that fantastic?
Who wants us all to be the same?
[00:10:40] Speaker C: Yeah, I think it's great.
[00:10:42] Speaker B: 100 me or no, I think it's great.
And then I'm always like, what was it we were talking about being an eldest daughter.
[00:10:49] Speaker C: But yeah, when people coming to you when they need something. Didn't. Didn't you once say, or maybe I don't know if it was you, but try three before me.
[00:10:58] Speaker B: Yes. Okay, so that's.
[00:10:59] Speaker C: I use that.
[00:11:00] Speaker B: What does that mean? Okay, so that's a teacher thing.
Because when I started I. I mean now.
Now I probably have more years outside of the classroom than in. But the try three than me is okay. There's some people who want you to come. There are some women ask me only like, I will tell you the right thing. And there's a.
And I do think we do things a different way. If you were an early childhood teacher and if you're a woman. Because that's all about the personalities in the room modifying the environment to the needs of the kids so you can bring out the best. I have taken that. I apply that in an office setting. And I said, you're a big, you know, 100 kids. It's a big kindergarten. Which can be funny, but. Right. Asking three than me is turning it back on the community. Go amongst your peers, talk to them. Maybe just in the talking, you answer your own question. Not that I'm not here. I will always be here. But I'm here usually more of a kind of like an emergency. That's why? If I'm on a headset, you know, people might say I have no boundaries. But if somebody's popping their head in, it's probably like when the phone rings, it's important. The same thing. And I said this recently. I give my cell phone number to all my staff.
[00:12:11] Speaker C: Right.
[00:12:11] Speaker B: In case of emergency. And I said, I frequently get any texts. I'll get some when the phone rings. And one day I saw. I was on the call. I was on the phone with somebody, with somebody else in the office. And I said, well, that's strange. This person's calling. Because people know if you call me because you've seen it, like, oh my God, mom. Like, why are you calling me at like 2 in the afternoon?
[00:12:31] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:12:32] Speaker B: But it turns out that I saw her. I said, I'm so sorry. Like, I called her back, she didn't answer. And then I get, oh, sorry. It was a butt dial.
But it was.
[00:12:40] Speaker C: But it is a good way to set boundaries because, you know, as a leader.
[00:12:43] Speaker B: But you are.
But you know, it's so funny. It was never set. I never said don't call. I think it's just how they. And this is the being seen.
[00:12:51] Speaker C: Well, it's a teachable moment as well.
[00:12:53] Speaker B: Right. But it's like I have said, I've talked about my phone. I mean, I'm addicted to my phone because I use it in a certain way. But you, you communicate this all the time.
And I think it's the boundary setting. You teach people to find their own information.
[00:13:08] Speaker C: But.
[00:13:08] Speaker B: And people will treat you how they teach, how you teach them to treat you.
[00:13:11] Speaker C: Totally.
[00:13:11] Speaker B: It's kind of like all happening. So. So yes, ask three than me. But you might get. And then I'll. And then I hear when the question does come. Well, three people, three different people said three different things.
So then I need to re. Clarify. And that's when you might see like a. An email that went out to everybody.
[00:13:26] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:13:26] Speaker B: And you won't know why. And if you don't need to know why.
[00:13:29] Speaker C: Exactly.
[00:13:30] Speaker B: It needs to be reminded. Yeah, well, I need to remind folks. So. Yeah.
[00:13:35] Speaker C: So we were talking about like, we're mentioning sort of some heaviness around being a woman in leadership and the eldest daughter and all these birth orders and how. How do you think women stop carrying everyone else's emotions? And do you feel.
Because my. In my world, I didn't know that that was something I was necessarily doing until it hit me physically. And I really.
It took its toll a few years ago. Right before. Well, right. Yeah. Right before I switched jobs. How do you think? Because. And we can also even touch upon like women in autoimmunity. Oh, how that's on the rise and how many women experience that and it goes back to like keeping your emotions in the body keeps a score. I could go on and on, but I won't.
How do you think women in leadership especially flush out everybody else's emotions?
[00:14:26] Speaker B: God, it's all of it.
I'm glad you brought up the body keeping the score because now I follow my nervous system like I will lean into and I know when it's good.
When things are okay. You know, in your stomach, you know how you're sleeping or not sleeping in a way you are kind of carrying it. Like in relationships, like one is the, the vessel. It's like I want in wanting to be seen and see others or give others that feeling of being seen. You're going to hear a lot and it's sort of again, it goes back to your code and what you're here for and like bringing out the best but doing the right thing.
I'm not fixing. And I've said this and I think I've said it when we were talking about like where trauma comes in the work. I. And I've said maybe not recently. I'm not. I'm your boss. I'm not your mother, I'm not your wife, I'm not your sister.
That's different. But, but the response would probably be the same in both scenarios. But it's really knowing it's a power thing because you, you could also abuse your power that way.
If you have people think I will only get the answer from her. Everything depends. If she's not here, we, what are we? That's. Then you're not doing it, you're doing it wrong.
[00:15:38] Speaker C: Enmeshment.
[00:15:38] Speaker B: And that's control. And that's right. And where's the control come from? Wanting to fix. Being the oldest. You are parentified because there was a time in your life, you know, when you're very sort of sensitive developmentally and things are happening but you know, you're, you're kind of like the elder in the village with your siblings, let's say. And you are, yeah, you're.
You're creating order, you are fixing, you're learning how to do it. I will say though it was so interesting, the 80s were a really interesting time to be a woman. Kind of like going through this or thinking about this because we had all of the self help stuff and I said, I remember like I was kind of like, rate. My bigger sisters were Ricky Lake and Oprah and Sally Jesse. And then it was Dr. Phil and then Dr. Drew. Oh, we were like little armchair psychologists. I'm like. And I, I felt like, wow, this was, you know, I, I had tools now, yes, things happen, but yes, we can, like, look at this little. Yeah, I thought I was kind of running the show, but not really because, you know, however, your relationship with your family and your parents and it's just kind of. And I. And I remember it was trudging along with that until boom, like, something happened. Like a significant thing happened in the family actually around the 4th of July, which I've spoken to families about, families staff about. And then it was just kind of like, like now there was no sort of, like, when there's no rule to follow, you don't know how to respond
[00:17:03] Speaker C: or just to jump in. Certain that you're mentioning are very heavily in masculine energy. And when we talk energy, it's not specific to gender. Right. Because we all, we all hold femininity and masculinity energy within us. And I know that in my world, I can speak for myself. Like, I do really well in masculine energy when comes to my job, when it comes to careers, when it comes to the gym, when it comes to, like, my body goals and things like that. I do very poorly in masculine energy when it's relationships and love. So I'm curious, in your world, as a woman in leadership, like, do you feel that just having your title.
[00:17:41] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:17:42] Speaker C: Is it challenging for you to maintain a balance of the two? Do you feel like you lean more into masculine energy because you kind of have to. It's a disposal.
[00:17:50] Speaker B: Oh, yes.
[00:17:51] Speaker C: For your position.
[00:17:55] Speaker B: You know, it's that. That plays so much of a role. It really does. And again, we all have the masculine and feminine in us.
[00:18:03] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:18:03] Speaker B: And you. That's another thing that sort of changes as you grow and develop and experience life. And it's interesting in our industry that so many of the women in the most powerful positions. Well, most of the people in post the most powerful positions are women.
And what do you. What are we seeing?
Do you have that. See education? You think it's very kind of like all about the kids and it's this. And it's like you're the mama Earth type.
[00:18:26] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:18:26] Speaker B: But Headquarters is not different.
It is. And also women in leadership with other men in leadership think it's not the same. Not the same.
You mess up, you. You misspeak, you misstep. It's. It's different for us.
[00:18:41] Speaker A: Can you talk?
[00:18:42] Speaker B: So the energy you have to be. And I think is masculine. And what I really like is, you know, and also having always had, you know, very close to my sisters, but then my friends were always boys and guys. And it's different. Sort of the. The questioning. I get lost when there's too much information and context and story and it's how men and women communicate. And I feel like it's more effective when it's in the masculine. Like, it's like, like a little bullet points.
[00:19:11] Speaker C: That's. Yeah.
[00:19:12] Speaker A: And I know.
[00:19:13] Speaker B: And we talk about this with men while. Yes, they are like that. Sometimes they. They do the first one and they think they're done.
[00:19:20] Speaker C: Right.
[00:19:20] Speaker B: And I'm like, no, but there's. And then with the women. And I've said this, not specifically like this. I said, you have to understand sort of like I'm. I think like that too. Especially at work. I'm like, when you give all of this story in context and oh, but her shirt was yellow and oh, you know, there were birds out.
[00:19:36] Speaker C: Just cancel.
[00:19:36] Speaker B: The men are like, what's the question?
What do you want me to do?
And I think together it's. It's great. And I feel like sometimes I'm doing both because I can. You'll see. I mean, I will just take us down a path. And, you know, the birds came and then there was a squirrel and everything else, which I think is very feminine. And. But then like. And this is.
[00:19:57] Speaker C: I think your femininity shines in your nurturing aspect. You are a cancer son, so that's a really big moon energy that's very nurturing.
You love to cook.
You want to, like, gather and like, people feel. Yeah. Comfortable. Feel good. That's very much feminine energy. And it's nice that you're able to bring that to your title as a leader. Right. Because I work faces and supervisors did not provide that. Did not make that make it feel like a home or make it feel like you're even basically welcome. So, yeah, I think that's the part where your femininity really excels. And I'm only bringing this up because I want this message to be, like, spread amongst women out there is like, find your balance. You can have a title, you can have degrees, you can be the matriarch, you can be all of these roles, but find where your femininity is somewhere in the mix. Because a lot of women, I'm not going to say all, but a lot of women do well also in feminine energy and where we see burnout, where we see exhaustion, where we see autoimmune conditions and these levels of just like depletion in women is because that's so unbalanced. And if you don't find your little niche, like you do your cooking. I have my own. Nina has her own. Like, if you don't find your little niche, it's constantly strategy, thinking, planning, doing, executing, fixing. That's really hard. That's really hard energy on a woman's feminine's body, right? So that's just like the message out there. You be whoever you want to be, love up the energies that you're in, but like find your little niche and, and, and, and spread it.
[00:21:35] Speaker A: Is there anything else aside from cooking that you do to kind of recalibrate and recharge and ground yourself or.
[00:21:43] Speaker B: I have to person.
Oh, oh, I, I am, I am an also an introvert. People don't believe me. I'm a hardcore intp I and a cancer and a night owl. Being a night owl served me well. I, even as a kid, I loved. I was like every. I'm awake and maybe the whole world is asleep. I can explore my interests. I could listen to my music, I could read my book. No one's coming for me.
If I get a text, I'm like, hey, like that's so funny. I was hosting a party last night up here doing the cooking, doing the thing I love. It also makes me crazy if you see me like during. I'm not the best. No, I really, I'm not. Like, I need the people to show up when I'm done and then I can go hide in a corner because it's so much, it takes so much to run to get the carnival from your head and execute. It was basically the other day, it was Thanksgiving dinner, that breakfast that we did. It was anyway, hosting a party last night and my phone rang. Phone rang and I looked down. It was. I was a Peace Corps volunteer. That's how I learned Spanish. I was working in the Bronx as a young teacher. I really wanted a understand the community that I was now part of. You know, Parent teacher conference in Spanish and not having to rely on Someone. So from 98 to 2000 I was in South America and Paraguay because now. And the World cup was big. That of course. And now we were going to like the games in South America. Well, now they're all gathering across the country. I didn't join them, but someone called and he had somebody else. We were good friends and he was like, Trish. I knew It. He's like, I. It was like 10 o' clock at night and I'm hosting. I took the call, I said, and then he was like, can we FaceTime? I said, yeah. He's like, I knew you would pick up. He said, I knew if I call, you would pick up. Like that never changed. And it was so good.
And it was kind of like I. I knew, I knew everything was fine. It wasn't like he wouldn't be calling me to tell me something terrible happened.
That opportunity to reconnect, you don't, you don't miss that and being. No. And it's sort of like, yeah, they come to you.
They come to you for all kinds of reasons. And maybe people are coming to you for. With a question, but it's really for something else. And I am fine being that person because if it's too much on me and I'm exhausted, I don't answer good. Oh my God, they'll be so disappointed. No, they'll be fine, whatever. Like you're living your life and. But I'm so glad I did pick up. You find your own balance.
[00:24:02] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:24:03] Speaker B: It's important sometimes people get. Because I've also been on this part of my own self care and I've said this. Buy the tickets, do the thing. If something costs. Tickets are so expensive. Let's say they're 200. I'm saying, okay, well, if you think you'll die tomorrow and you'll have $200 in a bank account somewhere, spend it now. Pour into yourself now.
Be the person. Be the end. I don't have any bio children that say, you know what? We'll have such a great time. Let's do it. Maybe you have to miss school. Maybe you pay more than you wanted to, but that's sort of being good to yourself. Getting the oxygen, putting the mask on so that you could then be of better use to other. I mean, they tell us this on airplanes and women know that the men might be like, wow, they might like jump into the fire.
Because they'll go and act. And we're like, no.
[00:24:45] Speaker C: And then can you agree that being strong, being the strong one can sometimes move over into just like sheer exhaustion?
[00:24:53] Speaker B: Absolutely, I will. I. I tend to be the person.
I don't sleep enough. I don't sleep. I am an insomniac dealing with all the autoimmune things and trying to fix and I think getting better, it's the c.
And you don't know if it's the job, if it's you you know, I'm also. I have more years behind me. I can't believe I'm saying this, because I still feel very much like in the. Want to really do a great job, you know, I could probably within three, two to three years be retired. I don't. But I'm not there. And it.
You have to kind of. It's like being in the ocean and being on a surfboard. You have to kind of like, see where the burnout might come. But there are some days where you just. Especially June is always a big month.
[00:25:35] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:25:36] Speaker B: And wrapping up a year. I'm already. But thinking about September.
For me, it's done. That's why it's like, happy bagels. Let's celebrate. And. But everybody's like, get out.
And the Cabinet knows we already have meetings on the calendar for summer planning every two weeks because everything goes so fast.
And I think for me, like, keeping it all okay, not having, like, a surprise, not leaving it till the end. And then that last week in August, that's why I don't want my staff. I said my vision is I don't want anyone to have a knot in their stomach on Sunday night. Like, as hard as the thing may be.
But I enjoy going in. It's not going to. I feel supported. It's.
[00:26:19] Speaker C: Well, being proactive that way and on top of things is also really good way to support the nervous system. Right. Because leaving. Leaving things to the end or leaving things rushed or leaving things undone.
[00:26:29] Speaker A: That's right.
[00:26:29] Speaker C: That just adds more pressure. That doesn't have to be there. So.
[00:26:32] Speaker B: Right.
[00:26:32] Speaker C: That's. That's great to be proactive.
[00:26:34] Speaker B: Procrastination is a big part. I'm a huge procrastinator. Huge. You know, I'm trying to. I'm doing 50. We all do. Like.
[00:26:41] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:26:42] Speaker B: It's like, totally finish it. Because then you sort of like, of course you're gonna burn out. You're gonna, you know, cry in your car. I'm a big crier in my car. I'm very emo that way.
Being born in June, you know, I get schmitzy sometimes if we're talking about. But no, a lot of times on the way. If I put the music on, that's kind of where it all really is. Like, the.
It's a whole backstory to my entire life. That's what I feel like. It's feeling. Music is just. Is feeling.
[00:27:10] Speaker C: The main message here for this podcast is to really just find your way as a woman. Like, find your niche.
You can be the boss you don't have to be the boss. You know, all these hats that we wear is really like, whatever you are, be a good one. Yeah, basically.
Yeah. You're with yourself wherever you go. You can move across the world, you can have different jobs, but you're still taking yourself with you always. And, and to know your strengths, to know where you excel in, in your masculine masculinity, femininity, all of these things. That's how a job well done.
[00:27:44] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:27:44] Speaker C: And it's thriving personally. Right. Just to have that, that balance.
[00:27:49] Speaker B: Because you'll never know. You'll never, never know. There's some people who are brilliant artists in their lifetime who are never discovered until 100 years later.
[00:27:57] Speaker C: You'll never know.
[00:27:57] Speaker B: Celebrate things. But I will say this.
You do get enough feedback. I'm very always sort of like listening and it's sort of anticipating, some people might say that type of vigilance, the anticipating of sort of what will come next at this point, you know, I, I also feel strongly that we shouldn't have to pass on and have every, like the community gather and eulogize somebody and say all of these wonderful things after they're gone.
I, at this point, I've gotten enough sort of feedback from either work or who I am in life. And you're never going to please anyone, everyone. And I've gotten enough feedback that is reinforcing to me saying I'm. I'm doing the right thing. Like the general impression, you may not know me personally, but. And you know, your name will come up, especially in our industry when you're doing something for a long time and then you meet people.
We. So fun. It happened last night and I was like, oh, you, you work like five minutes away from me in the. For a long time. Like, do you know who I am and how to give like the full name and the title. They were like, oh, my God. But it's not going to be, oh, I heard you're such a. You're a real miserable. It's generally what I would want people to be saying about me. My office, my staff. Because it's when you're at the, when you're at the top, it's sort of you, you represent. And some you, you, you are the, you're the figurehead of the school, the office, whatever, and then the larger organization and who we are. And when, when it's no longer my time and somebody else comes in, they'll do it their way, hopefully in communication and in collaboration with the people who are actually doing the thing yeah, this is fun.
[00:29:31] Speaker C: It's a great conversation.
[00:29:32] Speaker B: It is. This is why I love this. I do have another question.
When you were a little girl or
[00:29:37] Speaker A: like an adolescent, like I'm picturing like teenage Trish. I'm picturing old Trish or 8 year old Trish.
[00:29:42] Speaker B: These stages right when you were that
[00:29:45] Speaker A: go to person for your sisters, like how did you. Because as a child, I'm trying to picture like having that weight on your. Like how did you kind of like release that?
[00:29:55] Speaker B: I didn't do it very well because it's so funny and just I was. Recently I've been thinking about this so much because we presented on, you know, building psychological safety and emotional intelligence into office dynamic. Thinking about past childhood, you know, when you learn certain things. When things happened, I had no idea what I was doing as a kid. I was doing the best that I thought I needed to do. I needed to be.
I was probably hard. I was hard on my sisters.
We weren't, we didn't have that type of dynamic. And even when my sister was in the office, I asked a colleague, I said, would you ever think she and I are sisters?
[00:30:34] Speaker A: Nope.
[00:30:34] Speaker B: No. It's more like a mom. She was six years younger. I remember being in eighth grade when 1987, which was a big year going from elementary to high school. They actually voted me best listener.
All I did was take it in and you know, the people around me now are the people that have always been around me and it was always about, you know, making sure they were okay and heard.
Nobody knew anything because the face was always, there's nothing to see here.
There's nothing to see. What's going on in the home, what's going on in my head, what's going on. And I, I messed up a lot. And it took. It was a lot of years of figuring out who you are, not not wanting people to know who. What you were, who you were or things you had been through because you don't.
I'm sorry.
[00:31:25] Speaker A: Do you know like why you were like that?
[00:31:27] Speaker B: Trauma was trauma response 100. Now I understand it as an adult and yeah, that's where the control comes from. That's where the.
And, and it's sort of like it doesn't go away. Nothing ever goes away but forms you and you.
You ha. I think a lot of people sort of look at their past and treat it like something to be overcome.
I'm not going to talk about this but every, every type of experience informs. It changes you. Hopefully you learn from it. I know how Much. It was part of, it's part of your story. But also I, I think just doing the work, understanding, you know, what the priority is now, like for me, like you're going to stress me out to the point where you can. I'm going to be, I don't have time right now. Whereas I would never say no to anybody.
[00:32:19] Speaker C: So the biggest piece to healing or being able to move forward in that capacity is integration. And that's, that's what you're talking about. A lot of people feel like they need to fix. Yes. They need to continuously heal. The idea that you have to continuously heal is also a trauma response. Right. Because it's preventing you in some aspect from, from integrating. It's your story. You don't have to love it, you don't have to hate it. But if you take parts of it along with you, it's now not this big monster.
[00:32:48] Speaker B: Right. Yeah.
[00:32:48] Speaker C: And it doesn't become your identity, it just becomes a story that you can tell and it, and it takes away the power of it.
[00:32:55] Speaker B: Yeah. But also some things you just can never live with. And I think there's some things. And I think it's, it's also like your story.
You can meet somebody who's been through very similar things and you sort of wanna.
And it's realizing you've got to figure you got to do your, you got to do your time. Yeah. You got to do 40 days and 40 nights, like. Yeah. And some of its age.
[00:33:16] Speaker C: Do your bid.
[00:33:18] Speaker B: Sorry.
[00:33:18] Speaker C: Do your bid.
[00:33:19] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:33:19] Speaker B: What does that mean, a bid?
[00:33:20] Speaker C: Like a bid in jail. Oh, jail sentence. A bid. Sorry.
[00:33:25] Speaker B: Yeah. Where it's like for me growing Catholic school, Roman Catholic, like all of these, it's so funny all these things you say, like your 40 days and 40 nights in the desert, you're gonna have to struggle, you're gonna have to wrestle with it and I, I. And it's sort of like do this with you regnant like.
And they might not even know what you're talking about. But it's just kind of like I'm an elder and trust me on this one.
[00:33:45] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:33:45] Speaker B: I'm also at work and I got a million things going on. But that's, I think people don't appreciate. Well, you couldn't like just how much comes up and that goes on and all of these like big heavy things. You ladies know more better than anyone in the work that we do. I mean these parents people are coming in just a lot and having reactions in the moment and you want to be part of that. Dance sometimes. And it's very.
Yeah. It's trying to always find a solution or not others. I want to shut it down. I don't want. I'm. I'm gonna find consensus. I'm gonna tell.
[00:34:24] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:34:25] Speaker B: And it's. Listen, these jobs would be easy if there were no people.
[00:34:30] Speaker C: And.
[00:34:30] Speaker B: And I think.
And that's a whole other podcast. I think of how we. Where we are going in light of the pandemic and even this, which is a great. All these online tools that we have and opportunities to connect, but the struggle of the difficult conversation.
That's. There's an art to that. There's a need for it.
And I'm finding people are less and less comfortable with it. Whereas. How funny, though. And I'm realizing. I think I said comfortable with my grandmother's. So they're comfortable. Whereas back in the day, women. Those women, my God, if we could have them on a podcast now.
They went through. They said nothing. And I think it didn't.
It didn't help to think, like, they'll always be fine no matter what. You'll never see. Maybe you'll have like a. Like a big explosive. Like an outpour, a pot falling or something.
But going into menopause and not. How I will say, I'm the oldest one here, hitting 50 and beyond. For sure. They were going through the same things biologically.
[00:35:29] Speaker C: Absolutely.
[00:35:29] Speaker B: Struggling with no support.
[00:35:32] Speaker C: Zero support.
[00:35:33] Speaker B: Because the men ran the house. It was the men in charge of everything. And.
Yeah.
What a time to be alive, though. Here we are in 2026.
[00:35:41] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:35:42] Speaker B: So. And we're keeping you, you ladies of the future. So maybe you'll be doing my job someday.
[00:35:47] Speaker A: If there's one thing I want women to take from today's conversation is this. You do not have to earn rest. You do not have to earn support. You do not have to earn your worth. And success is not about becoming.
If this episode resonated with you, share it with a woman who's caring too much and pretending that she's fine.
[00:36:03] Speaker B: Thank you for having me, ladies. This was so much fun.
Yes.
[00:36:07] Speaker C: We loved it.
[00:36:07] Speaker B: I loved. I love talking. Talking shop about roots and wings and everything and bada bangs.
[00:36:16] Speaker C: Perfect.
